Good morning Grid Connections listeners.

In today's episode we're excited to have
Brenton Murray, the founder of

Electruck4x4 .com to join us.

We'll dive into Brenton's journey from
starring at Tesla, then working at Rivian,

and from there explore how Electruck4x4
came to be.

We'll take a closer look at the impressive
range of products Electruck4x4 offers for

off -road electric vehicles.

Brenton will share insights on the EV
models they currently support and give us

a sneak peek into the exciting EV models
they're planning to cover in the future.

We'll also discuss why EVs excel in off
-road conditions and the burgeoning

industry that's developing for aftermarket
items to support off -roading EV

enthusiasts.

If you enjoyed today's conversation,
please share this episode with at least

one friend or colleague who you think
would appreciate it as well.

And don't forget to leave us a positive
review on our podcast page.

Your support helps us continue bringing
you great content.

With that, enjoy.

Brenton thank you so much for being on
today.

And for those who may not be familiar, can
just give kind of like a little quick

background on how you got involved and
then tell us more about Electruck four by

four.

Sure, yeah.

Well, it's a long story, but I'll try and
keep it short.

But basically, I've been a car person, car
guy my whole life.

My journey kind of started in the
aftermarket.

I worked at a racing school in college,
and then I worked at a brake manufacturer.

We made racing brakes for classic cars,
muscle cars.

Went back to school.

I kind of had a crisis of conscience where
I was like, you know, this whole...

hot rod thing is great and all, but I kind
of also want to do something that's maybe

a little bit more productive for the
environment and society.

And so I got my MBA in sustainability.

At the time there was this company that
nobody had heard of called Tesla that was

working on a roadster.

And so they were on my radar.

I kind of packed my bags, moved out to
California, said I'll figure it out when I

got there and just started hitting the
ground trying to network my way into

Tesla.

Got a job there early on with the launch
of the Model S.

I was at Tesla for about five years, moved
on to another couple startups, wound up at

Rivian, was at Rivian for two years.

After that, I moved on and founded
Electruck 4x4.

I also worked at a company called Wind
River doing software product management

for software -defined vehicles.

And yeah, now I'm doing the Electruck
thing full -time and just

Yeah, continuing to build and support the
community.

No, that's I mean, that's such a great
foundational background to have to not

only have the electric vehicle and kind of
the software defined side of stuff that's

become so prevalent, but then also kind of
figuring out how can you implement

hardware, especially kind of like the
classic car background of what was OEM and

what was stock and then kind of how do you
take it to the next level and make sure

all these systems and components on a
hardware and also internal systems kind of

work together.

So let's talk about electric.

I know you have electric four by four, and
then there's also the make what kind of

product

Let's just kind of get a overview of both
and I'm sure they'll can open up the door

to a lot more conversations.

Sure, yeah, so let's see.

When I left Caribbean, yeah, back in, what
was it, 2022, there was an opportunity

that I had identified in the market for
accessories for trucks.

I had an R1, or have an R1T.

I knew a bunch of other folks that I had
worked with, as well as just other people

in the community that were owners and that
they had all expressed needs for different

accessories and things like that.

And so, yeah, I also...

knew that there are plenty of,
particularly in the overlanding space,

there are all kinds of accessories that
are universal, but just aren't marketed

towards EVs.

Things like ditch lights and various
brackets and things like that, tires,

certain wheels and things like that.

And so, yeah, I basically set out to
market those particular products to, at

that time, Rivian owners specifically, as
well as to develop additional products in

-house.

And so...

One of the big items that we developed is
the megawatt rock sliders, which we offer

for the R1S and R1T.

But early on there were some kind of more
low -hanging fruits, things like sunshades

and things like that that we designed as
well.

So rock sliders, I feel like one of the
big things people have kind of talked

about with, I think just off -roading in
general, but especially with some of these

electric vehicles, they're getting them
the off -roading space.

They're obviously awesome off -road.

I just even rewatched Top Gear's kind of
comparison between the Cybertruck and the

Rivian R1T.

Both did pretty amazing on challenging
terrains.

However, the concern I think a lot of
people have in the off -roading community

and just in general is just the general
price of the vehicles and so adding

something like rock sliders to help kind
of protect and minimize damage that could

happen while off -roading is that Has that
been an area that kind of lent itself

like?

Like starting with what products you
wanted to develop.

Obviously in some ways rock sliders are a
little bit just physically easier to add

to the vehicle.

But has there been any sort of decisions
around what products specifically have

like the highest return?

I think just a lot of people who are new
to the off -road community, those are kind

of the things they look at first just
because it helps them protect the vehicle

electric or not getting into the off -road
and sometimes the unfortunate side effects

that can happen with some of these fun
adventures.

Yeah, that was kind of the what what
prompted it really is I had a couple of

friends and co workers that I would go
four wheeling with we take our one tease

out.

This was pretty early days.

So yeah, in like, yeah, there was 2022 or
20.

Yeah, I can't recall the exact year.

But anyways, we go.

Yeah, we go four wheeling and we would
tend to push the trucks kind of hard.

But at the same time, you know, there's
that kind of continual pucker factor when

you're driving a vehicle that you really
don't want to get damaged.

And so rock sliders were a very apparent
need for us.

And then as I continued to engage with the
communities, both online and forums and

discord and other groups and social, you
know, on social and things like that, that

need was exemplified even further there.

And so, yeah.

reached out to some folks that I knew from
my aftermarket days and kind of shook some

trees networking wise.

They introduced me to some folks who are
fabricators.

They've been in the off -road and custom
motorcycle space for decades building a

lot of bikes for Hot Bike magazine and
they do a lot of work with Harley and then

they also dirt bikes and they...

Also do some work with rock crawlers and
trophy trucks and some serious off -road

stuff.

And so, yeah, started working with them.

They're out in Arizona, which is where a
lot of my aftermarket network is.

So drove out there, drove my truck out
there, and we spent some time kind of

going over some of the product
requirements as far as what we were

looking to cover.

Like a kick out, for instance, being a
feature that was important.

Obviously, the particular weight
requirements for an electric truck.

Yeah, spent some time designing and over
time came up with a pretty solid product.

You know, it worked without a few hiccups
and twists along the ways, but yeah, we

managed to deliver something that we're
really happy with and has been very

successful so far.

So I have a question for you.

You're working with these great teams, but
teams that have been pretty well

entrenched in the combustion engine space
for a while now.

I've actually been surprised to the
feedback and reception I have when I kind

of talk about that or like even sometimes
classic car conversions.

There is sometimes people who have very
strong opinions, pro and con, but I'm kind

of curious, what has been in your
experience overall the...

interactions with these like, I'm doing
these for electric vehicles.

What are their kind of thoughts on it?

Yeah, it's been really interesting.

So the yeah, the my aftermarket experience
was yeah, in muscle cars.

And so you know, I kind of throughout my
career transition from this world where I

would go into the office and people would
have carburetors on their desks to this

world where people have circuit boards on
their desks and things like that.

And, you know, the the guys that we I
partner with that are now part of the team

to manufacture these there, I would say,
you know, decidedly old school, you know,

they'll they'll

incredibly talented fabricators.

That said, I would say they're not,
environmentalism is probably not high on

their list.

Great guys though.

And so they're interested in and curious,
I mean, in developing new products.

They see the vehicles starting to be on
the road more and more.

They know the direction the industry is
headed.

They just saw the opportunity as well.

And so, I would say,

We exchanged some jabs at each other
about, whether it's politics or various

things.

But for better or for worse, we're all
aligned on the same ultimate goal as far

as expanding the availability and support
of accessories for these trucks.

And we've been really able to develop some
really awesome products as a result.

Yeah, I think that's great to hear because
I think that's been my experience too.

Environmentalism probably isn't the top
reason for a lot of people in the, whether

it be the classic car or the off -roading
spaces.

But what is pretty interesting to me is
that aside, they're always pretty

interesting, the performance and the
actual like...

usability or like how effective it is.

And I think more often than not, they're
pretty open to kind of like learning more

and have a curiosity around it.

And you're right, I think there can be
some friendly jabs made here and there,

but it usually is in kind of good fun
versus like.

being completely shut off to the idea and
there's an element I think also kind of

times are changing but at the end of the
day especially in if it's performance

related I think what is more interest to
them is like if it's better they're into

it or they at least want to be aware of
how it in what areas it's better

Yeah, I think with the exception of the
true zealots who are anti -EV or whatnot,

yeah, when it comes down to it, we're all
in this industry or in this car culture

because we enjoy them as machines and the
things they can do and the places they can

take us.

And so any vehicle that can do that in a
different or perhaps more performant way

is of interest to, just kind of transcends
politics or

things like that.

But yeah, early on, you know, we'd be out
on the trails and we'd come across like a,

you know, an H1 Humvee on the trail or,
you know, an old Jeep or something like

that.

And, you know, you kind of, you get a
little uneasy, you know, you're not sure

how this interaction is going to go out,
go down.

And almost every single time, whether it
was here or, you know, Arizona is a little

more, I live in the Bay area, but in
Arizona is a little more conservative.

People have been it's been positive across
the board people are really curious and

interested and it's been really awesome as
a result

Yeah, I actually have family down there
and took a EV conversion course that's

offered by a company down there called
Legacy EV.

And I think it has been really interesting
to see that sometimes there will be

definitely defenses and kind of walls up
by a lot of people when you start talking

about this.

But I think pretty quickly there's once
they kind of know, you know what you're

talking about for sure.

And that you're trying to come at it from
like a logical position of either

performance or

Having clear metrics of what you're trying
to accomplish and how like an ev may

accomplish that better.

It's definitely been Pretty positive and
people start kind of I actually when I

even took the course It was really funny
because I was pretty much kind of the only

let's say average joe in there There's a
lot of people from different companies and

a good quite a few were actually from
shelby america And so them obviously

building the massive like shelby,

I think everyone knows the Shelby Mustang
cars, but now they a lot of their cars are

actually like jacked up Shelby F three
fifties and stuff that are just like on a

whole nother level.

But they were also like pretty quickly.

They saw that there's a huge area for this
where these electric vehicles, whether

it's Pike's Peak or off road that have
some pretty big advantages.

So that's kind of great to hear.

And we're it's interesting being bring up
Arizona, because I think when a lot of

people think of the kind of

Not necessarily off -road, but third
-party space for cars.

Southern California, I think, comes up for
kind of tuning and like that sort of

stuff.

But there's such a large kind of industry
now.

I think there has been for quite a while,
but I've found it pretty impressive just

over the last decade.

And maybe it is some of it has been a
shift out of Southern California to the

Phoenix area and kind of beyond around
just

off -roading classic car and then now even
EV conversion kind of stuff in the Arizona

area.

Are there any things that you've noticed
as to why that is or any preference to

kind of working with third -party teams in
that area?

Yeah, so, yeah, I mean, the the
aftermarket has been, I'd say, strong in

Arizona for for a while.

That said, you're right.

I mean, you know, when you think of of hot
rods and things like that, SoCal is

definitely kind of the powerhouse.

Right.

That said, yeah, over time, you're
starting to see the economics just in

general of whether it's labor or real
estate prices.

The combination of that is driving a lot
of that.

growth in the Phoenix area.

You know, the area also, you also have a
lot of automotive culture around, you

know, Barrett Jackson is out there, Russo
Steel, a variety of other auctions out

there, and so that drives the automotive
culture big time.

But yeah, so I think the exciting part
actually is the growth in the EV space in

particular, right?

So obviously, you know, Lucid being in
Casa Grande, that kind of was the

the big, I would say one of the first big
stakes in the ground.

The OEMs have been using the proving
grounds outside of Casa Grande for

everything, EVs and otherwise for a while.

But yeah, now you're starting to see,
Licycle is out there for battery

recycling.

You're starting to see a lot of other
folks in the space starting to grow there

as well as the off -roading culture as
well.

Particularly growing up right there, I
don't know if you're familiar with the

term desert rat, but that's kind of.

Yeah, so like that sort of desert off
-road culture is big out there.

And so you need parts and accessories for
that.

That's spurring that aspect of the
aftermarket as well in the Phoenix area.

But yeah, a lot of different avenues of
growth out there.

I think that's just awesome to see because
there's been a lot of concerns, I think,

around electric vehicles.

And I think a lot of it in some regards is
valid around electric vehicles replacing

jobs and what is needed for the next
generation of vehicles.

But it's also been, I think, a lot harder
for people to look at how to go to the

aftermarket or how to improve their
vehicles beyond maybe just aesthetic

stuff.

I think we're finally starting to see some
of its right to repair, some of its

the automakers, especially the startups,
kind of being more open to sharing some of

the software and other stuff.

So you can actually, I wouldn't say tune
so much, but actually have more access to

that and like knowing what's going on with
the battery to kind of take these

aftermarket improvements to the next
level.

Now with the off road side of stuff, it's
in some regards, obviously aesthetic, but

there's a lot that you can bolt on that.

well, aesthetic has huge things exactly
like rock sliders where it's, it isn't

maybe so defined like maybe the
aftermarket for performance or car side of

stuff versus off -roaders.

So I'm kind of curious, you started with
rock sliders.

For those listening, can you share what
vehicles that Electruck 4x4 right now is

kind of focused on in the EV space and
maybe which ones you're looking to expand

to offering additional items for in the
future?

Yeah, I would say right now we're
primarily focused on the Rivian segment

within the EV space.

We also offer a handful of products for F
-150 Lightnings.

The Cybertruck is something of interest to
us.

We're kind of seeing how things play out
there.

There's obviously some support, a decent
amount of support already for the

Cybertruck.

But yeah, at this point it's been
primarily focused on Rivians.

The Silverado EV is another one that is
possible.

I think some of the kind of traditional or
legacy OEMs have been a little slower on

the rollout of trucks and SUVs.

And so, yeah, and then I would say on the
Tesla side, I'm sure somebody will have

some feedback about...

but the cyber truck, you know, it's it's I
would say it it is a very capable and

dynamic truck that said off -road it might
not be quite as capable at least, you know

until a couple upgrades or our OTA updates
or whatnot later as you know, like some of

the other trucks like the Rivian is a very
capable vehicle and and you know being

passionate about that the about four
-wheeling it just you know that that that

personal passion has really driven a lot
of that interest in

developing new accessories for that
vehicle, those vehicles in particular.

For sure.

And it's kind of interesting some of the
vehicles that you mentioned that you're

covering and looking to cover because I'm
curious when you talk about like Rivian

R1T, it obviously has that kind of off
-road.

That's a huge part of why people buy the
Rivian in general, let alone the R1T

especially.

And I think when you look at the R1T and
even the Cybertruck off -road differences

aside, they're kind of considered more
kind of lifestyle trucks.

And I don't know if that's necessarily the
right

I think people kind of say that to almost
cast them off, but I look at both vehicles

and obviously I want to see more of the
Cybertruck.

But what I think is really cool when you
look at it as like a spider graph, both of

those vehicles, maybe they don't do, I
would say like the, speaking of like the F

-150 Lightning and the Silverado, those
are very focused, like traditional kind of

work trucks that have kind of evolved to
be more lifestyle and like SUV

replacements.

Whereas I think some of the ones from the
startups are a little bit more, cover a

little.

a little bit of everything pretty well.

And so I'm kind of curious with the off
-road and just like the aftermarket things

that you're offering, are you seeing or
even positioning the different things for

like maybe what you do for the Rivian R1T
as being more focused for off -road and

then for the F -150 Lightning, probably
some off -road stuff, but also maybe more

for like if you are using it as a work
truck or kind of a clear different use

case day to day for what these additional
items are.

Yeah, you know, it is interesting.

I think the startups have done their
homework or chosen a great path there as

far as pursuing more lifestyle, if you
want to call it lifestyle trucks or

whatnot, just, you know, the margins are
going to be a lot bigger there in terms

of, yeah, so compared to a work truck,
which is going to...

And so, you know, we are support just by
nature of kind of what the...

those owners tend to be interested in and
gravitate towards.

That's where the majority of our support
there is.

The other thing is, you know, the F -150
Lightning, this kind of goes back to what

I mentioned about there being off -the
-shelf products that are already available

but just not marketed.

It's sharing the same, you know, a large,
yeah, exactly.

So, you know, suspension items, maybe not
quite the same.

I mean, we do,

have a number of F -150 Lightning
suspension items in our catalog.

I'm not sure if they're online right now,
but we do have access to those.

And so we do support it.

But that said, right now, it's kind of the
bread and butter, I would say, low

-hanging fruit that appeals to kind of the
broader ownership base rather than just

off -road or lifestyle sort of owner.

Gotcha.

And so when you start looking at like you
mentioned, Cybertruck Silverado, obviously

a big component of that is the actual
volume of these that will be delivered.

But what have what are kind of the I'm
just curious from yourself, what are the

determining factors like, OK, we're going
to start offering it is it has to be

volume or are there other kind of
considerations that go into what future

vehicles that you want to kind of offer
support for?

Yeah, I mean, I would say the determining
factors are a lot more basic than that.

We're an entirely bootstrap company.

And so it comes down to what's a mix of
what are the capital requirements in terms

of developing new accessories and then
what is the potential return.

And so owning an R1T myself, that makes it
a lot easier, particularly early on, to

develop products for.

for sure.

And then now the community in Arizona has
been incredibly supportive.

So we work with a number of owners out
there for, yeah, for measurement and

engineering of new accessories.

I don't have a Cybertruck.

I know a handful of folks who do.

It's, you know, the, we just kind of need
to see how, what that ownership is going

to be like, you know, what sort of
delivery volumes are going to be for the

Cybertruck and things like that.

So, and I, that totally makes sense.

Kind of taking a step back when you're
talking about, kind of choosing the right

products, what, not, not even for which,
cars by me or trucks, but what has been

kind of the determining factors or like,
is it market research or is it on

personal?

Like, I've like figuring out like, there
are ones he definitely needs rock sliders.

And then to kind of like, what are some of
the things that you're offering today for

people listening?

And then maybe go into some of the
products that

probably aren't ready just yet but ones
that you're hoping to really offer maybe

in the medium to longer term future.

Yeah, you know, we engage with the
community a lot on various forums as well

as on social media.

There's also a couple Discord and other
channels as well that we're engaged on.

So yeah, we work with owners there as well
as with the Rivian Clubs of America.

They've been great partners of ours as
well as just a variety of other places

like that to perform market research and
really assess kind of like what's the

demand.

The other aspects that we look at are, is
there an offering for that product

already?

Is somebody already offering that?

And then what sort of design and
engineering requirements are going to be

needed in order to develop that product?

What does manufacturing look like?

Is that something that can be easily
produced here domestically?

Is that something that has to be made
abroad?

some hybrid of the two, how complex is the
product, is there assembly required,

things like that.

So we kind of take all those into
consideration before determining where

we're gonna go next.

Gotcha.

That what we're gonna say.

yeah, and then I'd say coming down the
road, we're looking to do a number of

other off -road products for the R1S and
R1T.

The platform has been revised recently,
and so we kind of need to, that will

obviously influence where we go next.

But I would say things like,

steps or running boards as opposed to rock
sliders or something that's on our radar

in the future.

There are a handful of other items for
mounting things in the bed of the R1T that

are also coming down the pipe.

Yeah, those are a couple of them.

Yeah, I mean, this is a, it's a passion
project of mine.

It's something that I've put a lot of time
and energy into, but at the same time, I

also have a day job.

And so that kind of split, and obviously
now with a growing family, that makes time

a resource that is not as easily, it's
harder to find somebody who's willing to

invest time as opposed to other resources,
you know, and so that also is a factor.

For sure with with kind of where you are
and like you said there's there is a lot

you're kind of juggling But obviously
there's a big interest in the space with

where you are now What what are some of
the things that kind of like surprised you

along the way to get to where you are
whether it be?

Maybe things that were more difficult or
just maybe they're being a larger market

than you expect I'm just kind of curious
what what have been the challenges good

and bad maybe that you can share with us

Yeah, so well, yeah, there have been quite
a few challenges.

I mean, with the platform itself, the R1
platform changed.

There were some cost reduction changes
that were implemented that required us to

go kind of go back to the drawing board
and re -engineer some aspects of a couple

of products like the rock sliders.

That was a hiccup that we overcame.

There, you know, when you're...

Yeah, when you're bootstrapping something
like this, everything is new, right?

So everything from packaging, finding a
carrier who's going to support direct

consumer freight on an ongoing basis,
things like that.

That's been a learning experience that
we've overcome.

We also do manufacture parts abroad.

So there's four.

I tend to use, so yeah, I'm very
particular about which parts we'll.

build domestically versus abroad.

And it's kind of without naming any names
of retailers, but there are inexpensive

tool resellers that many automotive
enthusiasts go to.

And I use the same philosophy for when I
buy tools from those sorts of stores, and

it's the dumber the part, the more
acceptable it is to manufacture it abroad.

If it's a solid chunk of aluminum.

Sure, with the right partner abroad, we
can co -produce that or contract those

sorts of things.

And so, yes, building the supply chain for
that, as well as we also drop ship and

resell a variety of other products as
well.

And so building out that network of
suppliers has been a learning experience.

And then everything, yeah, I mean, I'm
kind of the, other than the actual

assembly and engineering of the rock
sliders, I'm kind of the chief cook and

bottle washer here.

And so,

learning everything from the e -commerce
platform.

We use Shopify, which luckily is very
intuitive, but kind of lean back on some

of prior work experience for some of that
other software stuff.

But yeah, there's been learning kind of
across the board and changes that we've

had to kind of follow in order to stay
competitive and keep growing.

I realize you're doing obviously the
majority of kind of getting this off the

ground and the bootstraps I saw.

But if you're willing to share, is there
any, if there's anyone listening, are

there any skill sets or something that
might be of value that if someone wanted

to work with you to maybe to reach out to
maybe kind of help you get electric moving

even faster or just kind of keeping the
momentum going.

Yeah, something that actually I found that
has been really unique to this particular

startup.

I've had a couple other startups in the
past, but something that's very unique

about this particular one is the community
aspect.

We've worked with owners who also are
building their own parts.

I've worked with owners.

There's a great guy who lives in Oregon
who owns a manufacturing.

company and he's he's co -produced some
some parts for us out of stainless steel

and been really great there.

I've worked with a number of owners to
design and engineer accessories like

brackets and things like that.

So shout out to my friends over at Sunish
.com.

They've been fantastic partners.

We've worked together on we make iPad
brackets for the seat back out of out of

stainless steel.

And so yeah, I would say folks with

you know, engineering expertise, that's
been great, you know, working with folks

there.

That's probably the biggest one.

I'm a software guy and I would say
aspiring mechanic, you know, I can rebuild

an engine or, you know, do things like
that, but I'm not, you know, an engineer

by trade.

And so having someone particularly with
like Fusion 360 skills, that's really kind

of like...

That's really the biggest part.

It's the, you know, the transforming the
sketch into a digital model that is then

manufacturable.

And then that can then be tested, you
know, to ensure performance and things

like that.

That's kind of, those are the skills that
I'm looking for really.

That's great to know and hopefully anyone
listening can definitely kind of reach out

and help you with that.

With where you're looking to kind of take
Electruck 4x4, can you share any of the

roadmap maybe that we haven't discussed
already that I realize this is kind of

your passion project and you've got a lot
you're juggling right now.

But is there anything you can kind of
share for maybe like the next year as far

as roadmap for where you're looking to
take Electruck and maybe expand into?

Yeah, I think Cybertruck is definitely on
the horizon.

I think we might pursue more of a reseller
route there, more so than building

Megawatt products.

I think there are a handful that it's
possible we might make, but yeah, it's

kind of a...

right now, we wanna kind of stay abreast
of where things are headed with the R1

platform.

And so I think, yeah, a combination of
kind of, I guess you could call it

maintenance and just staying up to speed
with changes on the platform as well as

expansion into more of the Tesla vehicles.

That's kind of what we'll see over the
next year.

Okay, that's great.

And I guess this kind of maybe brings a
couple of things together.

You're talking about not just expansion of
your business, but like one of the areas

you're trying to work on more is
community.

And I actually am involved kind of with
the central Oregon Land Rovers off

-roading group here.

Obviously not really EV focused, but is
that something that you're looking to do

on the community side is looking to kind
of do even maybe not like longer trips,

but even kind of day.

Rivian or other kind of focused vehicle
off -road trips or even just EV focused

off -road trips to maybe build awareness
or kind of get the name out there more.

Because I found that to seem like it's a
really effective way for people in kind of

your area to get the name out there and
definitely get those kind of adamant

customers that want to really return for
specifically your products.

Yeah, so we work a lot with the clubs, the
Rivian Clubs of America, both at the

national level.

Those folks have all been great supporters
and customers, as well as the individual

local clubs.

The club in Texas just did an event that
we sponsored here in the Bay Area.

There's folks in New York.

Basically, yeah, nationally, there have
been a lot of events that we've supported.

There are also a handful of off -road
schools that use Rivians.

And so we've been fortunate enough to
connect with them and they've become

customers and advocates for our products.

And so, yeah, really continuing to engage
with the community.

We're owners just as much as we are
contributors and suppliers.

And so we want to continue to...

participate as well as learn from the
community to figure out how we can

continue to better serve them and support
them.

No, that's all great.

and kind of awesome to hear because I
think that that has been an area that I

don't know.

I feel like over the last five years,
there has been such a, and maybe it's like

a unintentional kind of outgrowth of
COVID.

I feel like there has been a much larger
interest in overlanding and kind of off

-roading, almost like a rebirth.

I feel like, I feel like it's always been
a thing, but I just feel like the, and

maybe just personal experience.

I just feel like there's been such a
growing interest that we just haven't seen

for awhile.

and going to kind of where you're based.

I'm really curious, like in the Bay Area,
I lived down in Palo Alto actually for a

little bit, but I'm kind of curious, like
for you, where are some of your favorite

trails or like best areas to go to to go
off road and kind of get away from things?

Yeah, you know, it depends on how long
we're going to go for.

Hollister is great because it's right
there.

Yeah, Carnegie's nearby.

There are a variety of, you know, SBRAs
and OHV sites that are accessible and a

good time.

Personally, I'm a big fan of the Sierras.

So, you know, anywhere from Lone Pine to
Tahoe.

There's great stuff.

Death Valley is, yeah, I've got a soft
spot for Death Valley.

There's some great trails out there.

Infrastructure, that kind of comes back to
the unique aspects of off -roading in an

electric vehicle.

And so it's been a learning process,
particularly over the last couple of

years.

Luckily, the charging networks,
particularly in California, are getting

more expansive.

But even then, there's still areas,

If you're out in Arnold, which is a small
town, kind of, yeah, inland a ways kind of

on the way towards Tahoe ish.

There it's kind of a charging desert and
there are a lot of good trails out there.

You know, I, it's funny that you mentioned
the COVID thing because that's kind of

what reinvigorated my interest in four
wheeling.

I grew up kind of stealing or borrowing my
dad's truck going four wheeling, you know,

for,

years.

And then more recently, you know, when
COVID hit, I was big into camping and

backpacking, but campgrounds started to
get closed down.

And so, you know, I kind of turned to my
wife and I said, you know, like,

campgrounds be damned, we're getting out
into nature.

And so I bought an old XJ Jeep.

It was, yeah, it was, it was one of the
more interesting and also one of the more

ramshackle vehicles I've ever owned, but
it was great.

got us out there and that kind of then
continued on into the R1 ownership and

things like that.

And yeah, it's been awesome.

Yeah, I'm kind of like I think that's been
one of my things lately is a lot of the

trips we've done are kind of day trips and
I'm definitely looking to do more longer,

kind of few day, if not more extensive
trips or even doing just a long road trip

across the country and then kind of having
a couple, multi -day kind of, detours here

and there.

But it's interesting.

You mentioned the infrastructure side a
bit because.

I think a lot of people talk about that.

I think in general, EV charging has come
massively from where it was a decade ago.

And I mean, DC fast charging wasn't even a
thing pretty much a decade ago.

And now where we are today and you go by
like I -5 and pretty much any of the major

corridors, especially for kind of
passenger vehicle EVs, that's not a

problem.

But being based here in central Oregon,
really within the last year, actually both

Tesla and Rivian have expanded their
charging options, especially north and

south.

you're going west, but you had east of
here being in Bend.

There really isn't much until you hit
Boise.

And so that is kind of interesting when
it's looking at Rivian, one of the cool

things I've thought they've done,
obviously have kind of maybe slowed down

on the DC fast chargers, but they offered
a lot of level two charging and kind of

working with the national parks and
getting more places for that, which I

think is kind of the perfect balance.

You really don't necessarily need DC fast
charging.

You just need more plentiful and reliable
level two charging in a lot of these

national parks and other areas like that.

I mean, I'm just kind of curious, has that
been anything that with what you do and

kind of your background working in Riviera
and others, is that going to come up as

far as like a partnership opportunity of
like trying to look at areas to kind of

help extend and maybe speed?

the charging opportunities even through
kind of sponsored or advertised ways add a

lot more kind of off -road opportunities.

Yeah, you know, I have a number of friends
on both, I guess you could say, on the

Supercharger team, or you know, still, as
well as Destination Charging, and as well

as at Rivian on their waypoint team and
their RAND team, and I think both of

their, yeah, and each of them, you know,
they're kind of often under the same

umbrella.

But each kind of has a different mantra or
different methodology that they have

pursued to building out those charging
networks.

And so, you know, DC fast charging, you're
looking at corridors between spots of

where you're going to be camping.

But I think for those overnight lodging, I
think that there's an opportunity there

for partnerships with campsites.

It would be great to see, you know, more
national parks as well as US Forest

Service campgrounds.

to have integrated charging.

I personally prefer more backcountry
camping and four -wheeling.

And so having a 30 -amp charger at a
campsite is luxury, which is great.

But I think the opportunity to see more
level two charging at campgrounds is

definitely an opportunity that needs to be
capitalized on.

Well, it's kind of interesting to talk
about that too, especially when you start

getting the more off road and really kind
of making your own path sort of EV

adventures.

And there have been some really wild and
interesting, there's still pretty early

type, but kind of solar roof mount things
that I've seen for a couple different EVs

that essentially do spread out and kind of
unlock to anywhere from one to two

kilowatts of solar, which is a decent, I
mean, it's not.

of solar, I mean for portable, yeah.

if you're gonna be like camp there or
something it obviously will kind of cover

whatever usage you're gonna use for your
Water and some other stuff and maybe

recharges the battery a little bit, but
I'm kind of curious I'm sure as someone

personally who's been in the EV space like
one of the first things you get her asked

about are kind of Why don't you put a
solar panel on it?

and I'm just kind of curious being on now
the off -road and the

side that you're on selling these
products, I'm sure you get a lot of

questions around kind of products around
that or how has that been?

Yeah, you know, it's that conversation has
been the same since I since I was at

Tesla.

You know, at first it was road trips pre
-supercharger, right?

How are you going to get to how are you
going to go on a road trip?

And so it's and it's really difficult to
kind of convey it in a way that sinks in

and registers with people until they like
until you actually like try it and own it.

Then if you really understand the kind of

how overblown a lot of the range anxiety
is.

You know, four -wheeling, we'll go out for
a couple days out in the backcountry and

when you're sitting there camping, you're
not consuming a lot of power, even if you

do have, you know, string lights hooked up
and, you know, an inductive cooktop and,

you know, all these other things that are
great luxuries to be able to have and run

off your truck, you still don't use that
much.

And then when you're rock crawling, you
don't consume

that much energy, you'll spend a whole day
out in Hollister and use under a hundred

miles or, you know, I'm sure somebody's
going to blast me for an inaccurate

statistic there, but you'll use
significantly less mileage than you would

expect.

It's kind of the only situation it seems
like where your power really goes is if

you're doing a lot of sand stuff and then
and obviously then you're going to.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, high speed or even
just kind of mess around the sand.

But even then, you're right.

Like the majority of the time, especially
rock crawling stuff, it uses definitely

some.

But the Delta is.

pretty small compared to what you think
it'd be, especially as opposed to like

doing highway driving or something.

Exactly.

Yeah.

I mean, we've gone to King of Hammers the
last couple of years and that's way out,

you know, in Johnson Valley.

And there's this last year we towed a
trailer as well.

And so, you know, I would say that that is
the only, the only time when range anxiety

has become a thing is that combination of
middle of nowhere and towing.

That said, you know, Optima has been
great.

Optima batteries has been great about.

providing charging out there.

They had this whole hydrogen powered DC
fast charging setup this last year.

So we're able to continue charging.

Even then though, I think you could still
do a night or two out there and still be

fine.

But yeah, I mean, as long as you plan, if
you're just going four -wheeling or

overlanding, if you're in the back
country, you're going to use significantly

less than you think you're going to use,
although it's nice to plan with a buffer.

But yeah, you also get, you know, regen
back and so you're going to get that back

as well.

And so, yeah, I think it's just a, it's a
learning experience and just, you kind of

have to do it in order to fully
internalize it.

You know, you can, you can talk about it
and have it register, you know, but it

doesn't actually register until you,
you're, you do it yourself.

Now, and I think I even kind of realize
how fruitless like usually adding solar to

any sort of UV is, but there have been
just, I feel like it's only within like

the last six months and I still don't know
how practical it is, but there are now

these stationary things that essentially a
roof mounted that fold out and now you're,

it's still not a whole lot, but the fact
you're kind of getting around the two

kilowatt mark, you're like, okay, that is
a decent amount of solar.

And that could actually, if you're not
driving far, or if you're like based,

camp for a couple days.

It's probably a net positive.

Yeah.

Well, exactly.

Exactly.

I would say, when we first started going
out and it was a concern, I was like,

okay, well, what if we run out of range?

And so I found myself driving on conserve.

I'd be on these dirt roads, just, traction
was mostly there, but probably could have

been in a different drive mode, but just
for the sake of using as little

energy batteries and blah,

yeah.

Yeah.

Well, and I'm like, as someone who's been
in the space for so long, I realize it's

really not necessary, but I still kind of
fall for it every now and then.

Like, God, that does seem kind of cool
just to get, you don't have a generator,

you don't have to have anything.

If you have like just enough solar, it
doesn't need to be a lot.

And especially when the battery's that
big, yeah, you could be like posted out,

especially like in Southeast Oregon or
anywhere in the Southwest.

It's like, you could be out there for a
week at least.

Yeah, I think it's definitely that, you
know, that.

Yeah, exactly.

It's it's it's kind of, you know, it's
it's it's the dream.

That's the ideal scenario.

Unlimited gas from that, you know, falling
from the sky.

No, exactly.

Well, OK, so let's I realize we're kind of
coming up a little bit here, but when

you're looking at some of these products
that you're trying to offer for electric,

have there been any?

I think one, it's just such a new thing to
have, obviously electric four by four is

that anything is kind of a great option.

But are there any things that you're most
excited about or like you really want to

maybe take to the next level for
specifically an electric four by four?

You know, suspension systems, I think, are
an opportunity there.

Obviously, focusing on Rivian specifically
right now with the air suspension, which

is fantastic.

The truck is kind of a Swiss Army knife of
performance, which is great.

Great road handling as well as off -road
handling.

That said, long travel suspension, higher
ground clearance, and things like that

does provide

an opportunity, particularly for more
aggressive off -road or higher speed.

I think we're starting to see more and
more motorsports involvement in the off

-road space.

I think things like short track racing and
other more off -road, Pike's Peak is

fantastic, but it would be great to see
more off -road involvement.

got paved, I think would be like the
perfect ride.

Yeah, yeah.

a Rivian.

I know there was definitely a Cybertruck
at the Mint 500 this year.

I don't know as far as actual competition
wise, but you know, just having the

representation there.

And I think from there, you'll start to
see more, you know, those suspension

systems that are capable of supporting,
you know, higher impact, longer travel,

higher performance, those sorts of things
are something I'm really excited about.

You know, that's a great topic actually,
because there's so many people, even

coming from the non -EV space, like the
defender world, everyone's all about that

hard axle, like traditional kind of stuff,
like in the old Jeeps and obviously the

Land Rovers.

And I'm a big fan of them personally, but
what starts getting really interesting is

there's a couple of companies, one in
particular of Australia called airbag man

that, which is just such a funny name, but
they have an airbag system, airbag ride

system for a hard axle.

And it is truly,

not just about like delivering a better on
-road experience but what it can do off

-road without impacting your travel and
stuff is unbelievable.

It's obviously not the cheapest thing and
I think there's a lot of kind of

predisposition and understandably so from
some of the history of like air ride

systems being really finicky or breaking
and then you think well semis use them

there's a reason.

But either way, people start kind of
getting scared off because it does seem

like it's such a much more, there's
obviously an electronic component to it.

There's just the air unit unto itself.

And so that's really interesting to hear
that.

And it makes sense that there'd be an
opportunity for that, but you look at the

Rivian, you look at the Cybertruck, both
of them have air suspension setups.

What do you think are like the easiest
ways?

to get those big ones.

Is it really just increasing the ride
height, increasing the ability for travel?

I've heard from some on the Rivian, I'd be
curious on your take on this, is the air

tank itself kind of could be bigger and is
like that something you could see as even

being a replacement too.

Yeah, you know, obviously there's trade
-offs with raising suspension.

Drag goes up significantly.

You're going to lose a lot of range.

And so I think for an off -road or
motorsports application, those sorts of

lifted or long travel suspension systems
are more kind of like traditional shock

and spring setups can be a bit, or yeah,
are great options.

You're seeing

Airbags Continental makes a great product.

And so, you know, you're seeing things
like airbags on an air ride on, yeah, the,

the cyber truck and on the Rubian, because
you're trying to be that jack of all

trades, right?

You know, you want to, you want a truck
that you can take to the track and then

you can take off road and you can't do
both of those things unless you have the

dynamic suspension, you know, off, you
know, in an airbag, or other, yeah, other

dynamic suspension.

So.

Personally, it's a longevity thing as well
as a complexity thing.

Trail repairs, being a Land Rover owner,
I'm sure you're all too familiar with the

hunting down leaks on lines and things
like that.

But yeah, I think it's a great product.

It's a great configuration.

I just think.

for yeah, that sort of more high
performance.

You start to have to, there are trade
-offs that have to be made and that's kind

of, yeah.

well that kind of just remind me of
something I does the Rivian does it have

an electronic does it have a sway bar or
is it essentially kind of like a because

of the fluid system that it has the
hydraulic system it has it kind of creates

like a fake sway bar essentially

Yeah, so it has hydraulic roll control.

It's very similar to some of the systems
on McLarens and basically compensates.

Yeah, it's really cool.

And again, that's another one of those
things where it's like, okay, you want to

make something that's very dynamic and
performant, but at the same time, then you

wind up with additional complexity.

And so I think in terms of the future of
overlanding and off -road, particularly

truly off -road capable EVs,

I think simplicity is something that we're
going to need to see more of.

Also in terms of affordability, the
Rubian's a fantastic vehicle, but there

are a lot of bells and whistles.

And so I think some of that could be
stripped out for the sake of just

durability, longevity, and obviously
affordability.

Well, it's funny you should say that
because I was going to throw out possibly

a product idea for you guys.

If you do go down the path of cyber check,
because one of the interesting things

about it, just with the research I've been
doing, kind of looking into it, is it does

have a sway bar, but it doesn't have a
physical or electronic disconnect.

Just some of the reviews I've been
watching lately.

It's like obviously now that the locker
updates kind of gone out It's definitely

improved pretty significantly its off
-road ability, but the travel issue is

kind of still it's not bad But that could
be an area would be better.

I've just be curious on Because I feel
like it wouldn't be even if you did a

manual one That would be a pretty big
improvement and there might be that may be

a quick off -road win for people who are
looking to do that with their Cybertrucks

No, it's a great point.

I think lockers are probably a pretty
transformational change.

But then independent suspension does have
its limitations in terms of travel and

being able to disconnect that sway bar
would go a long ways.

And you know, I'm not as familiar with the
electronic systems like on Toyota.

I mean, obviously that's kind of big one
with a lot of the land crews, the newer

land cruisers and the forerunners as they
just don't electronic one.

Do you know if that would ever be easy to
do as like a third or essentially

aftermarket retrofit option?

Not even Cybertruck, because I just don't
think I've even seen that.

I could be wrong.

I just don't think I've even seen that
many in for other vehicles.

Yeah, you know, I think, yeah, if I recall
correctly, there are some reliability

issues that Jeep owners have had with,
yeah, with Rubicon and just having that

sway bar disconnect.

I think a lot of folks actually have
deleted it.

But yeah, you know, with the right
platform, I think a retrofit is not out of

the question, but I think, yeah, the cost
associated with it as opposed to something

that's manual.

might not be worth the trade off.

for sure.

Interesting.

Well, no, I really appreciate this
conversation.

And this has really been just kind of a
fun area to talk about that I'm excited to

see grow more.

And I think honestly, it's been an area,
especially if you're on the West Coast,

that

I think a lot of people I talk to, it's
part of the reason they've kind of held

off on going to EVs is maybe they maybe
they're not a traditional Jeep or some

other kind of driver, but they have a
Subaru or something because it has the

ground clearance and has a little more of
at least the adventure ability that you

really haven't seen until the entry of
Rivian.

And like we've kind of talked about as of
now, at least there's still a bit of a

price issue.

So seeing more opportunity and just kind
of future products coming out to help with

that, I think such a great thing.

there's anyone that's kind of looking to
reach out to you or learn more about your

product, what's the best way to kind of
get in contact with you or like learn more

about Electruck 4x4?

Yeah, and folks are welcome to email me
directly, brenton at Electruck4x4 .com.

There's always the website, Electruck4x4
.com.

We're on a number of social outlets.

We're pretty well engaged.

The door is always open, live chat, any of
those things.

Yeah, very accessible and happy to engage
with folks about their trucks, about just

the industry.

or yeah, the hobby or passion for trucks
and off -road as well.

And I think that's actually something to
mention.

Did you say before our conversation,
you'll be at SEMA this year?

Are there any other events that you'll be
at, you know, just yet that maybe if

people want to talk to you or meet with
you in person?

Yeah, let's see.

So, yeah, I've been going to SEMA for a
while.

I'm not sure if I'll make it this year.

I'm gonna try.

Same thing, King of Hammers.

We've gone in the last few years.

I'll try and go again this year.

Let's see.

There are a couple EV Expos we'll be going
to as well.

Yeah, I would say, you know, if folks are
in the Bay Area, definitely shoot me a

note.

I'm also out in Phoenix from...

you know, pretty regularly.

Otherwise, yeah, just email and all that
other stuff.

Happy to, happy to engage with folks.

That's great.

And thank you so much for coming on today,
Brenton looking forward to kind of just

seeing the company grow and talk with you
more about this space specifically.

So we'll definitely have to have you on
soon.

Thank you so much.

Chase.

Yeah, thanks for having me.

Thank you for tuning into this episode of
Grid Connections.

We hope you enjoyed our conversation with
Brendan Murray, the founder of electric4x4

.com.

It was fascinating to learn about
Brendan's background, the genesis of

electric4x4, and the innovative products
they offer for off -road EVs.

We hope you found insights on the current
and future EV models covered by

electric4x4, as well as the growing
aftermarket industry for off -roading EVs,

both informative and inspiring.

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